[CLOSED] TC does not inject AIGFP or MAIW BGL traffic (P3D)

TimC340 · October 15, 2023, 10:11:52 PM

Hi all. First time post in this part of AIG, but I'm an experienced FS user and an occasional developer for MAIW.

I decided (after putting it off for ages) to try TM and TC on my installation of P3Dv5.4. Having seen several of Kaii's posts over at MAIW I thought I really ought to get to know these programs, especially if we want to see MAIW traffic in MSFS. However, this post is purely about P3D.

Installation was fairly painless if time-consuming. I have some observations about that, but they are not for this post. I did run into the issue with Windows Defender kicking TC out, but having read about it I knew how to deal with that.

The issue I have is that TC appears to be injecting a variable, but always tiny, amount of AIGFP traffic and suppressing all of the thousands of MAIW BGL plans I have installed. I also have Traffic Global and UTLive 2 installed on this copy of P3D, and they appear to be unaffected.

The installation includes almost all of Orbx products, including their AI traffic, and that traffic appears to be OK. I also have GSX Level 2 which I suspect may conflict with some of the features of TC/TM but I can't be certain about that.

My MAIW traffic and airfields are normally injected into the sim via Lorby's P3D Addon Organiser, using the XML protocol. None of my traffic is within P3D.

Any advice would be gratefully received! The Logs are attached.

johanfrc · October 15, 2023, 10:24:09 PM

the BGL files will for now not be injected by AIGTC, only the AIGFP files.

BGL files for MAIW will come at some point. It's still in testing phase.

The BGL's are therefore still controlled by the sim and it's Traffic % slider. So you need to have that in a high enough setting to make it work.

TimC340 · October 16, 2023, 11:34:39 AM

Hi Johan. Thanks for your answer, which only partly answers my question. All of my bgl traffic files are suppressed, despite the P3D traffic slider being at 100% (and it was all working prior to TC being installed). Also, only a very few of the AIGFP files are being injected - often it's none at all. On the map display within TM/TC, it confirms that only UTL2 and Traffic Global airline traffic is active.

johanfrc · October 16, 2023, 11:51:42 AM

Then I have no clue. I'm on MSFS and haven't had a BGL traffic file installed for ages now.

But AIGTC aren't supposed to and shouldn't suppress BGL files. There are quite a few P3D users who uses both BGL and AIGTC, and they don't have any issues with that. So something else might do it.

TimC340 · October 16, 2023, 12:51:08 PM

Obviously from MAIW's point of view I'm primarily interested in P3D and FSX. I have MSFS, but that's not my primary focus just now as frankly it's a PITA to create stuff for! I of course understand that TC/TM shouldn't suppress BGLs, but it certainly is doing so. And, with 350 aircraft types and over 1500 flight plans in the AIG installation, I'd expect to see a fair bit of AIG traffic around - at least near major airports - and I'm mostly not getting any at all. On some P3D starts I'll get a few exec jet movements, but no airline stuff.

I'm wondering if any of the other addons are conflicting with the AIG programs, and I'm sure I'm not the first with these addons to try AIG's traffic programs. Has anyone else seen similar issues?

I'll try firstly disabling my other addons one at a time to see if I get more AIG injections, and if my MAIW xml (bgl) traffic returns.

Kaiii3 · October 16, 2023, 02:05:27 PM

BGL support for MAIW is MSFS only.

TimC340 · October 16, 2023, 05:13:21 PM

Quote from: Kaiii3 on October 16, 2023, 02:05:27 PMBGL support for MAIW is MSFS only.

That's understood, Kai. What I'm trying to find out is why P3D bgl traffic is suppressed when AIG TC is running in that sim.

Kaiii3 · October 16, 2023, 05:18:41 PM

traffic slider in P3D set to 100% ?

TimC340 · October 17, 2023, 09:21:06 AM

This has been discussed upthread. My MAIW traffic installation for P3Dv4/5/6 is over 100Gb; it's a common XML installation for all my sims via Lorby's P3DAddonOrganiser, and is set to 100% at all times - I frequently see 200+ tracks in busier areas of the world. I have installed AIGTM/TC in only P3Dv5.4 to see how it works and assess whether it offers me any advantages that I can exploit for the way I use the sims. As soon as AIGTM/TC was installed in v5, my MAIW bgl traffic disappeared, very little AIG traffic was generated in any location, but Traffic Global and UTL2 were running and generating traffic as normal.

Along with TG, UTL2 and MAIW (the old Matrix installation now under Lorby), I have a full Orbx installation (including their traffic), and GSX Level 2. All of this is visible in the logs.

So, in my installation of P3Dv5.4 AIG is:

a) not generating much, if any, traffic.
b) suppressing bgl traffic injected via XML generated by Lorby's P3D AddonOrganiser.
c) but not suppressing traffic generated by Traffic Global, UTL2 and the Orbx traffic files.

I bring this up as much to inform you as to solve the problem for myself. As my focus is mostly military AI, I can live quite happily without AIGTM/TC - Traffic Global and UTL2 inject an adequate amount of civil traffic, although it's not necessarily accurate. They feed my occasional desire to see the airliners I flew in-sim!

johanfrc · October 17, 2023, 09:27:12 AM

The strange thing is that we have never had any reports on this before.

Many people have been using a mix of both AIGTC and BGL files for P3D and have not had any issues at all. No suppression. Even with full MAIW installed. Many also have the ORBX traffic too, but that's often limited to the Australia and New Zealand area. So yeah. Many have been running a mix of AIGTC, BGL, MAIW and ORBX and no problems.

The only difference seems to be the Traffic Global, UTL2, which I'm not sure many are using nowadays, which might be the reason why it has not been reported.

Maybe try to not run those 2 latter ones, and see if that changes anything.

TimC340 · October 17, 2023, 01:57:31 PM

Hi Johan.

I've been digging through this all morning and I have made some progress. Using Lorby's P3DAoO to monitor which components are active, I noticed that my North America military traffic (my AI traffic is collected in regional folders) was switched off. With P3D shut down, I re-activated it and restarted the sim. All appeared to be well!

However, I am certain I didn't make that selection. Doubting myself and my aged memory, I restarted the sim several times. Most times it was fine, but on one occasion the North America traffic switched itself off. Once off, it needs to be manually switched on again with the sim off.

Now, I can't dig any deeper to find out if it's AIGTM/TC that's doing this! I did try a couple of restarts in other areas to see if this happened anywhere else, but didn't see any further unwanted behaviour - and I've never seen this before. As it takes around 10 minutes to load up P3D each restart, I lost the will to investigate further - and I'm supposed to be building stuff IRL today, so I can't do any more on this just now.

So I don't know quite what to think. Was it me? I don't think so, but I can't rule it out. Was it AIGTM/TC? Well, I saw one further instance of the NA military traffic spontaneously switching off, but I can't deduce what caused that. I'll keep watching and if I can provide any further useful information, I will.

Oh - on moving the observation point to Norfolk, VA, I managed to get some AIG traffic appearing. Of 137 (IIRC) aircraft in the area, I think about 5 were AIG. That seems a bit low to me considering the number of AIG flight plans that I have installed, but I can investigate that further through TM's charts.

johanfrc · October 17, 2023, 02:06:13 PM

AIGTC should, as said before, not turn that one off at all. It simply shouldn't be able to, as it's 2 separate programs and they are not corresponding to each other.

So maybe it's an issue in the MAIW program?

Norfolk, VA is not the largest airport around, and remember that AI traffic only spawns around 40 nm around you. So that could be the reason for so few planes (plus the other traffic programs might also take up space at airports and similar).

But at least I think we can rule out AIGTC and AIGM. It seems to be an issue with the MAIW program.

Kaiii3 · October 17, 2023, 02:07:05 PM

AIGTC does not disable any other addon

TimC340 · October 18, 2023, 08:37:10 AM

Quote from: johanfrc on October 17, 2023, 02:06:13 PMAIGTC should, as said before, not turn that one off at all. It simply shouldn't be able to, as it's 2 separate programs and they are not corresponding to each other.

So maybe it's an issue in the MAIW program?

Norfolk, VA is not the largest airport around, and remember that AI traffic only spawns around 40 nm around you. So that could be the reason for so few planes (plus the other traffic programs might also take up space at airports and similar).

But at least I think we can rule out AIGTC and AIGM. It seems to be an issue with the MAIW program.

Yes, I agree that it's probably not AIG directly. There is no 'MAIW program'; the MAIW traffic in my installation is injected via xml in the P3Dv5(or 4 or 6) Add-Ons.cfg - as is AIGTC (see the cfg file attached). Is it possible that there could be some occasional conflict arising due to the way P3D handles the xmls? At least I've now worked out how to recover it, anyway.

As for the civilian traffic, I did also look at the New York area (EWR/JFK/LGA) and again there seemed to be very little AIG traffic. I didn't check each of the 400+ tracks noted by LittleNavMap and AIGTM, and I accept that UTL2 and Traffic Global may be a bit quicker to generate their traffic than AIGTM and thus get first dibs at airfield parking, but that shouldn't affect traffic generated in the air - or should it?

I entirely accept that I'm new to the AIG programs and thus may be making silly mistakes or assumptions, so I do appreciate that you indulge my queries!

johanfrc · October 18, 2023, 02:25:39 PM

AIGTC is not an addon like those other ones.

It's a separate program that has to be started, either by the sim or by you, when the sim starts. This happens in the exe.xml (I think it's called) and not by any other programs or similar.

If AIGTC is not started, the traffic won't be injected into the sim. And it should read the traffic that installed via AIG Manager. Nothing else. And only of that traffic is installed as AIGFP files instead of BGL files. But that traffic is highly recommended NOT to change anything there, as it's likely to simply not work if those files are edited at some point.

So for AIG, think of it as a completely separate program and addon that should not be opened with i.e. LORBY or any other editor programs. It has to run completely on it's own.